Highly Suspect Reviews: Captain America – Civil War | One of Us

Highly Suspect Reviews: Captain America – Civil War

75 Submitted by on Thu, 05 May 2016, 11:16
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In the wake of massive destruction and a sizable death toll, the world is beginning to become unsure about the decision making abilities of the superheroes that seem to be multiplying like tribbles. Strong feelings run on both sides. No more so than between Tony Stark and Steve Rodgers….

CIVIL WAR

…which brings in ALL the characters, pretty much, in a Marvel film that felt for sure it would feel overcrowded like Age of Ultron did to some, and yet…

But what am I telling you here for? The review is right there with Chris, Sarah, Joe, Herman, JC, and Beau. Push the button.


http://www.entertainmentearth.com/cjdoorway.asp?url=hitlist.asp?searchfield=funko+legacy

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Born in the wilds of northern Virginia, in 1992 Chris managed to put all of his survival skills to use and barely escaped with his life to Austin Texas, where ever since he’s dabbled in everything from plumber’s assistant to sandwich maker, from band to bar management. An opportunity to see theatrical release films for free, by becoming a critic on a local public access show called “The Reel Deal”, turned into a full time job when Chris and his friends decided to take it to the internet. They built the site Spill.com, adding multiple podcasts and animated features, to no small amount of success. During this time, a fortuitous friendship sprung up between Chris and young Brian Salisbury, who was also a local film critic, and they merged their forces of will, and their laundry list of ideas for shows, to eventually build this paradise you see before you.
  • mythic

    Hmmm… they praise Evans showing off for the ladies here and yet Cyrus bitched about Gal Gadot having cleavage in their BVS review. And if a male geek drooled over a female character the way Sarah did here she would probably label him a sexist, misogynist, objectifying pig.
    SJWs are the biggest hypocrites on earth.

    (To be clear I am all for sex appeal for both genders being in entertainment, but I will not tolerate people of like mind with you guys constantly demonizing creators left and right for putting ANY female sex appeal for guys in comics and film and you guys sitting here enjoying the equivalent for females)

    • Chris Cox

      Do you get that using SJW as an insulting term kinda knocks you automatically out of the discussion, right? It’s about akin to using the words ‘liberal’ or ‘feminist’ and assuming they’re understood to automatically be an insult. Might as well quote Rush Limbaugh at this point as to say, “Oh, my god, those people are concerned about the way gender, race, etc are being portrayed, they are HORRIBLE people”. Seriously, these are pretty complicated issues that are being discussed by pretty much everyone who is involved with entertainment at this point and if you want to dismiss it completely because you’re frustrated that the discussion is happening at all…I don’t know what else to tell you except to stop, take a deep breath, and maybe actually put down your prejudices and read something for REAL about the issues being discussed, intellectual discourse and the like, instead of just screaming to the heavens that assholes are getting in the way of your superheroes. I don’t agree with all the controversial hot-button specifics either, and yes, this has got to come to some sort of understanding with a calming down on BOTH sides soon, but you don’t get to say anyone who thinks this is a discussion worth having is a hypocrite. You just don’t.

      As to what you misrepresented here about what I said is that I (who is this Cyrus guy?) was addressing not that there was some sexualization of the character Gal Gadot played, but that every outfit she had on EXCEPT the Wonder Woman costume looked like it was held on with spirit gum. A bit different than suggesting there can be no eye candy. We DO want women to be represented as more than just a pair of tits and ass that can high kick in our superhero movies as surely as we want our male superheroes to be more than just a set of straining abs and a tight butt. Sexy is fine, but don’t be ridiculous about it.

      • Ditto on Chris’s first paragraph.

        Ditto ditto to the second paragraph as well. There is a difference between objectifying and admiring someone in a physical, sexual way. We make it VERY clear in this review that this film is complex, and in this review and previous ones, we’ve made it equally clear that Captain American and Iron Man are both multi-dimensional, extremely human characters. Their looks are not what defines them, but it is part of their characteristics. Looks are important to an extent (it’s part of Cap’s marketing in canon), but they are absolutely secondary to Cap’s character.

        This isn’t Sucker Punch in which the action centers almost exclusively around how the characters can be objectified and sexualized in various ways with gossamer-thin or no character development. If any action movie does that with regards to their male characters, you better damn well believe we at Oneofus.net would be saying something about it. (I’m trying to think of a male equivalent to Sucker Punch. I can’t.)

        But you know what? Why are women and men not allowed to admire the male form without being called hypocritical? Oh right. Because you’re not used to it. The shot we’re referring to with Cap’s bulging back muscles was probably not explicitly for the female gaze, but it can very well be viewed as such. Scenes like that are rare in action and sci-fi because the assumption is that the primary audience is male and straight. When suddenly the male, straight audience is confronted with a shot that is NOT intended to stimulate them sexually (most shots of female characters) or is NOT intended to incite violent victory, aggression, or rage (most shots of male characters), they fail to see the point in it. I’ll tell you the point: Chris Evans is a fit, beautiful man and this shot was not made for you.

        • mythic

          But the problem is what is objectifying or not is subjective, I haven’t seen Sucker Punch, but I’ve heard from several people who think the female cast was genuinely sympathetic even if they are weren’t deeply written so they were able to attach themselves to them and be invested in their story at the same time that they enjoyed their beauty on screen.

          “Because you’re not used to it” “and this shot was not made for you.”
          Your not getting it, I have absolutely no problem with films putting fanservice for females in them or you commenting on the guys in the film in general circumstance.
          I have a problem with Cyrus being so afraid to offend you that he immediately apologized the 1 time he commented on Scar Jo’s body.

          You loved Deadpool getting strap on fucked, but I guarantee had they had Morena Baccarin topless onscreen for more then half a minute you would have been violently pissed.

          • Chris Cox

            Once again, misreading. That was a joking apology for commenting on Scar Jo. I REGULARLY comment on how hot I think women (and sometimes men) are from movies and tv shows on our various podcasts. I was JOKING. And no, I would NOT have been ‘violently pissed’ at Baccarin being topless in said sequence. You’re assuming things about my take on this that are not at all correct.

          • Beau

            As long as we are dismissing any kind of useful conversation by means of an acronym born on fucking REDDIT for fucks sake…

            You used a discussion about how impressive Evans guns are (and how dreamy he is) brought up BY A GUY on the review to leap to the conclusion that Sarah would savagely rip into the rest of the team if we talked about how hot a girl in a movie is (something ALL the guys on this site have done in one way or another) despite NO evidence to support your view (and sorry, an offhand apology from Chris doesn’t prove that ANYONE on the site would “label him a sexist, misogynist, objectifying pig”).

            But that is neither here nor there.

            You took an oblique comment or two in a GUSHING review of a movie everybody LOVED and decided to talk about how “girls just aren’t fair, goshdarnit!!”

            You leaped to incredibly broad conclusions as to two of our reviewers’ motivations (and, dude, it’s a movie review. Really?).

            Then the whole site takes a hit with the implication that “you guys [are] constantly demonizing creators left and right for putting ANY female sex appeal for guys in comics and film and you guys sitting here enjoying the equivalent for females”

            ANY?????? Who the fuck are you listening to? It sure as fuck isn’t me, and if it is you are a HIGHLY selective listener (and my voice can be heard in small rural farming communities in Mongolia).

            Yeah, yeah. We got a social agenda. Not like you at all, right?

            Chew on what has been said to you. And try to grow up and realize no one is trying to choke out your cleavage (or dude bicep) supply.

            aka Frank Cho is alive and well and still making money from ripping off Milo Manara.

          • I think he was responding to my comment about the “violently pissed off” thing. As in, I would get pissed off because I can’t stand to see a naked woman. (Which is why I have zero mirrors in my house and shower fully clothed.)

          • Jonathan Snyder

            “Which is why I have zero mirrors in my house and shower fully clothed.”

            So do I.

          • Mr_Plainview

            I showered naked once, when I close my eyes I can still hear the screams. Never again, never again.

          • I’m sorry. I’m so so sorry.

          • Jonathan Snyder

            That was actually me screaming. My bad.

          • Jonathan Snyder

            Dude just be quiet. Nobody really wants to hear your pitiful complaining, especially when you use terms like “sjw”

          • mythic

            Yes it’s pitiful to try and preserve what you love and hold dear in entertainment.
            If males tried to force publishers to stop making female romance novels, women would fight back just as we are. Would they be pitiful? Nope they would 100% justified just as I am.

          • Jonathan Snyder

            “Yes it’s pitiful to try and preserve what you love and hold dear in entertainment.”

            No, its pitiful when idiots like you make an unnecessary attempt at it, and in the end, accomplishing nothing.

          • mythic

            How is it unnecessary?
            Virtually every single time a movie or TV show has female nudity people demonize it as objectification no matter how well written the character in question is.
            As if men aren’t capable of enjoying a characters visual beauty and being invested in her character’s story at the same time.

          • Scott Johnson

            You know, we wouldn’t have those problems in the USA if men didn’t teach younger generations that enjoying your sexuality is wrong and that it should be suppressed. See all the motherfuckers still trying to promote abstinence when it doesn’t work. That’s who you should be pissed off at, the people that actually have established the old guard against both genders rather than the people who simply complain/comment on it.

          • Jonathan Snyder

            What the fuck does this have to do with Captain America Civil War? Take your weak arguments elsewhere.

          • Mr_Plainview

            “Virtually every single time a movie or TV show has female nudity people
            demonize it as objectification no matter how well written the character
            in question is. As if men aren’t capable of enjoying a characters visual beauty and being invested in her character’s story at the same time.” <— This right here is the problem. This right here shows you don't seem to have any empathy or understanding of the actual issue.

            When a female character is portrayed in an overly sexual manner in media the problem with that doesn't have anything to do with how men see it or how it affects men at all. The problem is that for a very long time women are primarily portrayed in media as objects of desire rather then as actually characters. Women are treated as second class at the best of times and background props or sex dolls the rest. The issue isn't with how will those portrayals affect men, but how will those portrayals affect women.

            You're going to need some empathy here so brace yourself: Imagine you are a young girl (or woman) and every time you see a woman in any media the only important aspect of her is her looks. She is only in the story to serve as an object for the man to save, or to support the man. If she's a intelligent character she'll only be listened to if she is impossibly beautiful and only after showing of her impeccable looks is her mind taken into account. If she's a strong bad-ass character, then she unlike her male counterparts, is always show in skimpy/formfitting impracticable outfits that accentuate her impossibly beautiful body first, her combat prowess second. The strong male characters however just wear what works for the most part. The male characters that are strong have muscle mass that makes sense for their strength. The female character however is a stick-figure supermodel (rather then a buff looking woman that would make sense) because she looks better slim and sexy rather then realistically built. Now imagine what message this sends to young girls and women and imagine how this would affect their view of themselves. Instead of being confident in their abilities and who they are, they would be constantly told that the only thing that matters is that they look sexy. If they want to be taken seriously they must first meet an absurd standard of physically beauty.

            That is the issue. It doesn't have jack diddly to do with what men are or aren't capable of enjoying or seeing. The issue isn't about men and men's views or reactions. The issue is with the bar it sets for women that want to achieve anything in this world. You're a woman and you want a leading or major supporting role in a film? Look sexy first. You're a woman and you want to be seen as smart? Not till you dazzle men with your looks can you dazzle them with your mind. You're a woman and you want to be a bad-ass? First you have to look sexy and wear something appealing. The issue with the over-sexualization of women isn't about men's views, it's about women's. Look outside yourself and you'll see that.

            The issue with objectification of women today is no different then when every single time a black person was portrayed in the media they were a servant to white people, a criminal, or just there to dance and smile at the white folks. The problem with that wasn't that it was insulting that white men weren't capable of enjoying those black characters despite being portrayed that way. The problem was that portraying most black people in that way was insulting to the African American community and closing doors for them in real life, just like today's objectification of women is insulting to women and closing doors for them in real life.

            Yes, it is getting better. Yes, things are changing and more doors are opening. But the fact still remains women are often only viewed for their looks and not for their abilities, and every time the media accentuates a female characters looks over any other attributes it is a painful reminder of socially instituted sexism and the limitations it places on half of our worlds population.

          • mythic

            “If she’s a intelligent character she’ll only be listened to if she is impossibly beautiful”
            Pic related suggesting otherwise… https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/04decac3d7e7f994f62adfabd6eb8a14ec561f034643f12b4e30b2da67bdd6b7.jpg

          • Scott Johnson

            Oh god, they aren’t going to your comics away. You don’t even mention this movie if you like it or not and worst of all, you are trying to defend Sucker Punch without even see it. You say SJWs are hypocrites but try to pull that shit of “Oh, well it’s not an insult using it in that way!”

            You’re complaints are weak, pointless, and it saddens me that most of the comments on this page are just you bitching about the hosts thoughts on gender in media. Like its the end of the fucking world. Grow up and stop thinking women are going to ruin your lives. You’ll be much happier for it.

          • mythic

            >>You say SJWs are hypocrites but try to pull that shit of “Oh, well it’s not an insult using it in that way!”<>”stop thinking women are going to ruin your lives”<<
            Where in God's name did I even imply I have a problem with women?
            I have a problem SPECIFICALLY with modern Internet feminist that treat wonder woman having cleavage as being a moral crime against their very gender.

          • Scott Johnson

            But you used the term anyway in a negative connotation. So that point is pretty hypocritical. The hatred of “modern feminism” usually comes from this bloated mudslinging idea that women hate men and desire censorship in favor of feelings. When if anything, feminism is just common fuckin’ sense that acknowledges the problem society has against women and striding towards making both genders equal, good and bad. If that problems bothers you so badly, then I think you might have trouble judging both genders in that regard. Can’t you just judge the “outrage” side of culture as extreme and not view it as the norm because it isn’t willing to have a conversation?

          • mythic

            Feminism is making sure women have equal legal rights with men, feminism is making sure women can fairly get jobs, feminism is freeing sex slaves, feminism is stopping acid attacks.
            Feminism is about fixing things that actually harm women out in the real world.
            Women being sexy in film or comics does not harm ANYONE.

          • “You loved Deadpool getting strap on fucked, but I guarantee had they had Morena Baccarin topless onscreen for more then half a minute you would have been violently pissed.”

            Hey look. A man telling me how I would feel in a hypothetical situation. Great job.

      • mythic

        I wasn’t using SJW as a insult, I said it as its factually what you are good or bad.
        I have no problem with the Discussion happening, I have a problem with the insanely extreme places your types take it.
        Random Example – Their are people demanding Frank Cho never work again because he made several sexy pin ups that didn’t even have nudity for fucks sake. And dismiss him as a hater of women despite the fact that he donated 1000$ of his hard earned money to a abused women’s shelter.

        And the outfit she wore in her hotel and on the plane wasn’t sexual at all and the other 2 outfits were dresses she wore at Lex’s Gala and the museum where such atire was contextually appropriate.

    • Mr_Plainview

      Lol, you do realize that SJW was a term invented by bigots so they would have a derogatory phrase to use to insult people who aren’t bigots like themselves.

      • mythic

        Yes it’s soooo soooo bigoted to be sexually attracted to women and want to see them be attractive at times in entertainment just for the sake of attractiveness.
        Such vile evil It is.
        I don’t know who created the term, don’t care, the community it refers to wears the term proudly, so I’m going to call them such.

        • Mr_Plainview

          When and where did I say it’s bigoted to be sexually attracted to women? From reading your posts it beyond question that you are a person with psychological issues and you lack the mental acumen to actually engage in any sort of intellectual discourse. The crux of all your arguments are based on ignoring what is actually said, then infusing your own delusional view of some imaginary comments that exist only in your head, and responding to those statements rather than any real comments that were made.

          Living so completely divorced from reality must be a real struggle for you in your day to day life. You clearly have some real anger issues and those sorts of emotions only come from a place of deep pain and emotional anguish. There is help available, and I encourage you to seek it out.

          • mythic

            You implied people that use the term are bigots for disagreeing with the people that qualify as SJWs.

            Just because bad people use a term, doesn’t mean it’s a invalid description or that all the people using the term have the same worldview.

            “it beyond question that you are a person with psychological issues”
            What in christ name are you talking about? I haven’t even cursed anyone in these comments, for God’s sake.

          • Mr_Plainview

            “You implied people that use the term are bigots for disagreeing with the people that qualify as SJWs.” —No I laughed that someone was using an absurd term that was invented by bigots to insult those who don’t support overgeneralizing an entire social group and hurling derogatory comments at them. You are clearly interjecting your own bias into what I said.

            “Just because bad people use a term, doesn’t mean it’s a invalid
            description or that all the people using the term have the same
            worldview.” —No you’re correct, which is why by that logic it’s ok if someone starts yelling racial slurs. I’m being a little nit-picky on this one but your logic here is very shaky. It depends on the term, like for example the N-word, it doesn’t matter what your view if you use that word you’re an idiot. Or drawing a swastika. Sure you might not be a Nazi, but what would you say to someone getting a swastika tattoo and telling you it’s ok since they don’t consider themselves associated with Nazis. The term SJW was invented and used almost exclusively by bigots, this doesn’t mean you are one for using it, but it does mean the likelihood is high or you are very misinformed on the words context.

            “What in christ name are you talking about? I haven’t even cursed anyone in these comments, for God’s sake.” —The fact that you somehow think cursing is “the indicator” of having issues is honestly kind of disturbing. You do realize that you can have all sorts of psychological issues or anger issues and not curse right?

            The simple truth of the matter is that you initially had huge umbrage with the discussion in OOU’s review in regards to “constantly demonizing creators left and right for putting ANY female sex appeal for guys in comics and film” yet in the actually review they barely mention anything about it. You clearly had some massive chip on your shoulder from somewhere and decided to let loose here over nothing. And that is not the type of reasonable response from a healthy happy mind. You came in swinging and throwing out sweeping generalization about “SJWs are the biggest hypocrites on earth” and said “And if a male geek drooled over a female character the way Sarah did here she would probably label him a sexist, misogynist, objectifying pig.” And you did all of this over what? A few seconds of joking talk in a long review about a movie. That is not the type of behavior of someone who is happy or mentally stable.

            Let me provide an example of what a normal person who felt they had a problem with perceived gender double standard talk or sexism in the review would have said: “Hey guys, I enjoyed the review, but I have a comment that’s a bit of a concern of mine. You talked briefly in the review (and previous ones, the BVS review for example) about the gender issue of female character being objectified, yet in this review Sarah constantly made comments that I felt objectified the males characters. Do you guys see an issue with this, and isn’t it an example of gender double standards and just sexism of a different nature? I mean if we can be ok with male characters in these types of movies having their physiques objectified then aren’t women equally able to be physically appreciated. After all they aren’t just slabs of meat, we can enjoy the physiques of both male and female characters in film and TV while still respecting and enjoying the deep well written characters they portray. What are your guy’s thoughts?”

            >Now mythic go back and reread your original comment and see if you can spot the difference.

          • mythic

            No because SJW as a term is not even bloody remotely comparable to racial slurs. It doesn’t have a billionth of the history the N word does plus its extremely vague in comparison. Its identifying a group’s ideology not their race, skin color, religion or culture.

            “and used almost exclusively by bigots”
            Bullshit, I see it used daily by hundreds of people on the net by people who hold limited or no malice towards the people they use it to refer too.

            Overrating about a personally important issue equals being insane…
            Fuck you, your the one that has no god damn clue about mental health.

    • Terence Pang

      Guys drool over hot girls all the time. The difference is, we give Gal Gadot props for being a badass in spite of being so physically attractive.

      • Beau

        I can’t help it. I’ve read over all of the comments on this multiple times and I still have no idea what fucking point you are trying to make.

        But kudos on tits that kick ass.

        • Terence Pang

          I think i was trying to reply to the guy Chris replied to. The dude was comparing Chris was criticizing Gal Gadots skimpy costume to Sarah gushing over Cap and Tony.

        • jcdeleon1

          ..

    • Terence Pang

      Also, she was being ironic

      • No, I really WOULD have died. This is how weak my constitution is.

  • Charles Armstrong

    I loved the movie, but I still was feeling the length by the end of it. Much like Wolf of Walk Street where I recognize everything I’m seeing works and is entertaining, yet I was wondering how much longer this was going to go near the end of it. 9/10.

    • Terence Pang

      I agree. I felt the length although I enjoyed most of everything that Marvel was trying to do. Almost every character was fleshed out.

    • Chris Cox

      I hear ya. Sometimes I’d rather watch these superhero films at home, so I can take an intermission break. But, I was wide awake and all in for this one this time so it didn’t hit me with the tireds as sometimes happens. Can’t fault you for the perspective though. 2+ hours has really become the standard, if not the shorter end, of big genre films these days.

    • Jack Omally

      Hey armstrong, this was the only way i could get in contact with you besides Skype. If you are down for a podcast this week then tell me or be there on Saturday like we usually are. Cool?

  • Jake

    I can tell everyone genuinely enjoyed the film, but every time they got off topic and even broached such subjects as social issues or sex politics I died a little inside because I KNEW the shit show it would start in the comments. Sadly I was not wrong.
    If I had any major criticisms to say about the review it would be that Chris seems to have a habit of speaking from a position of authority even though he is mistaken, such as when he confused Zemo with Zola. Also, I also wasn’t too keen on Sarah’s contributions, as discussion was frequently halted because she didn’t know certain characters or events prior to the film and often needed clarification, which I feel really brought down the flow of the conversation. In fact, she seemed to have very little to say beyond the superficial that it felt like she was only present because there was an empty seat.
    I also felt a lot of the humor in the review fell flat because a lot of it relied on the previously mentioned socio-political issues they kept broaching. Sarah’s comment about Winter Soldier’s trigger words at the end especially made me cringe in embarrassment at how forced it felt.
    I typically love listening to this website’s comic book film reviews because they tend to be very interesting discussions about not only the films themselves but how they compare/contrast to their comic book counterparts and the discussions and humor that are drawn from that, but this particular review was just missing something, as if everyone was attempting to dance around some unspoken issue, and it showed by the people in the conversation just not being as funny as usual.
    Or hell, maybe I’ve been listening to too much Double Toasted where they just feel far less restricted by…whatever elephant was in the room during this recording.

    • Chris Cox

      So, your problems with the review were:
      1- I was mistaken on one thing which was quickly cleared up so it was weird to hear me leading the review (as always) because of that.
      2-Previously us talking about social issues or sex politics has brought out some gamergate-ish behavior in the comments so even though we really didn’t talk about either during this review, your fear of trolls coming out in the comments made this a not good review?
      3-Sarah saying anything upset you because she wasn’t religiously knowledgable about the universe (I think she’s mainly just missed Age of Ultron) or because you projected some sort of uncomfortableness into the room that none of us felt.

      Does that about sum it up?

      • Jake

        1- I was just using a single example. There were other points where I felt you were mistaken, it’s just that I didn’t wish to elaborate because that would require srubbing through an hour long, somewhat rambling discussion to cherry pick more examples and I felt the Zola/Zemo thing was sufficient.
        2- Yes I had a problem that you even edged towards social issues because it contributed literally nothing and seemed like you only brought it up simply BECAUSE you knew the flame war it would cause. If you can honestly say that simply stating the term “Actually it’s about ethics in gaming journalism” won’t cause a shitstorm coming from either direction of that particular argument then you’re either lying or haven’t been paying enough attention to the issue to have anything relevant to say in the first place.
        3- I wasn’t upset by Sarah saying anything, I just felt that she didn’t really contribute much to the conversation. I’m not expecting anyone to sit there with the MCU wiki page open during discussion but I am at least hoping that if you review Civil War you at least saw the pertinent material that forms the crux of the film’s conflicts, and I just felt Sarah was lacking in that department, especially since most of her comments were less on the film itself and more on how everyone looked in or out of their costumes.
        And hey, maybe I was projecting uncomfortableness because I know I felt uncomfortable after the review finished up, and not just because I knew the rather charming level of discourse the comment section would become. You guys had an American Civil War bit in the opening that was genuinely funny but you kept repeating it and it became less funny as time went on, to the point that you brought the whole thing to a screeching halt because you were futzing with your phone just to get music to beat the dead horse one more time. So yes, I cringed a lot listening to some of those offhand comments and poor attempts at humor and I guess I projected that on you guys.
        So yeah, I didn’t like the discussion and I thought other people I had listened to did it better, whether by being funnier or more interesting or simply by not dragging tired, inflammatory memes into things.

        • Jack Omally

          Yeah, I can see what you mean after listening. It is kind of cringy to hear a “joke” that got old the second it came out, that also goes nowhere in this case and is also a little bit insulting. And I’m sure these guys would say the same with people saying SJW, joke or otherwise.

          Honestly I like Double Toasted a little bit more when it comes to talking about controversy because they can play off each other and set up a devils advocate with each other and when the mood gets to heavy they can joke with each other a lot easier to get rid of that heavy feeling in the room so to speak. But Really I enjoyed the review and thought they did a fair job like they usually do.

          • See you over at RageSelect.

          • Beau

            Ok. I’m gonna do the devil’s advocate thing here.

            Could it be, just maybe, that RS and DT use long term formats?

            I know we’ve definitely gone into said issues on Original Gentlemen podcasts. Devil’s advocate? Maybe you haven’t subscribed and listened?

            C’mon did you rally want us to pull the review over to talk about this? Because I really REALLY, no, EXTRA FUCKING REALLY fail to see where we didn’t do our job here – it’s an audio review of a movie in which we let it be known UNEQUIVOCABLY that we loved the movie.

            The idea that we should pull over a review – which is a distinctly different thing from doing an hourlong game play through or a multi topic podcast format to give equal time to…WHAT EXACTLY? That ScarJo’s buns are as hot as Chris Evans’ pout? Is facile at best and completely misunderstanding of the review format we use here at OOUS at worst.

            If you wanna hear us dig deep – pony up and be a subscriber.

            I’m totally glad you like the review and the job we do…but I resent the comparison between us and our brother casts. This is an audio one shot review. Dunning it for not being in depth as RS or DT isn’t even apples and oranges – it’s acorns and vibrators. They just aren’t the same thing or forums AT ALL.

          • Jack Omally

            I never said anything about making the review an hour long to talk about one failed joke. What was talked about was good, like I said. I feel like you think I’m bitching about the whole review when I’m not. Or it feels like you’re mad about what Mythic said before and think that’s what I am saying. And I’m not, far from it. All I said was I agree with Jack when it came to ONE thing and then said what I felt when it came to controversial or social stuff on this site and that there is just not a lot of chance of talking about it on this site compared to your brotherly sites. And if your only place is one podcast that can be only listened to for a subscription then I feel like I’m kind of right. But if you guys are talking about controversial stuff and getting other viewpoints then, hey great, that’s fantastic. Other then that I said nothing else other then I liked the review like I usually do.

            I get not comparing to Rage Select because that’s a game site. But I do feel comparing a Movie Review and Entertainment site to another (DT) is okay. Especially when both were birthed after the same site they were all apart of got shut down and are, like you said, brother sites.

        • Chris Cox

          1- Really? Fascinating. Do tell. It sounds a lot like that’s all you could come up with other than possibly points where you might have felt my ‘opinion’ was wrong, which isn’t actually being wrong as it’s an opinion.

          2-I have never, ever, said things on here attempting to start anger in the comments section. Now, YOU on the other hand. And anyone who still thinks the gamergaters have a point? I’d be fine not having them as listeners, quite frankly. Everything in your #2 column makes me think you’re dodging around the fact that you’re one of them.

          3-I listened to the review again. Sarah talks about ALL Kinds of things. You’re full of it. I feel like you’re lacking in giving women the same credence as men when they open their mouths. If not, all evidence based on what you’ve written as opposed to what’s actually in the review points that way.

          • Did you mute your speakers for 95% of what I talked about? Or do you just hear white noise whenever a woman speaks?

            My points and contributions are equal to everyone else’s on the podcast. I love that I get to express my opinions freely and openly, and that they are taken seriously by all the voices on OneofUs.net. It’s upsetting that we have listeners who feel I’m unqualified to comment on a mainstream blockbuster created for the widest audience possible because I didn’t pass some imaginary Marvel Knowledge and Mastery Exam (I failed the moment I had to fill out my gender). But at the end of the day, I am SO lucky I have friends/fellow podcasters who don’t care where I’m coming from, who know highly enjoying the majority of Marvel films is MORE THAN ENOUGH BUT NOT A REQUIREMENT for anyone to open their mouth and speak.

          • Jake

            I actually tried to shy away from pushing an agenda one way or another regarding gamergate or any political issue because I think dragging that kind of shit into the discussion is nothing but divisive mud flinging (Sports, Religion, and Politics, the Unholy Trinity of Flame Wars) and has no place in discussion of, well, geek topics like super hero movies. You clearly have a different opinion. So much for “cultivating a spirit of community and inclusion” I guess.
            And I had no idea my opinion on Sarah was my opinion on ALL women everywhere. Which is strange because I don’t find Dodger of Co-optional Podcast, Barbara, Meg, and Ashley of Rooster Teeth, Danielle of Double Toasted, or Emily Gordon of The Indoor Kids nearly as vapid, pointlessly angry, or ill-informed as Sarah.
            You and your League of Extremely Ordinary Gentleman podcast used to be my favorite part of Spill when it still existed. So when you started Oneofus.net after you guys split up I was actually excited since I was basically expecting a sort of 24-hour version of that podcast but expanded. This review and following comment thread has been nothing but a cavalcade of disappointments for me.

        • Ken Walker

          Did Scar Jo get fat in this movie?

          Oh no, sorry it was just Sebastian Stan that we are judging….

      • Capt_Hat

        “gamergate-ish behavior”
        C’mon, Chris, don’t tell me you drank that Kool-Aid and blindly believe those BS claims about GamerGate too. You’re a smarter man than that.

  • RoverRandom

    The Ken Burns Ashokan Farewell thing got me good, I am still laughing.

  • Terence Pang

    So, are you guys always drunk when you do reviews? Especially Sarah.

  • Terence Pang

    Bucky, Cap and BW are genetically enhanced. There was a character who fell and got really hurt.

  • jcdeleon1

    Does this settle everything?

  • Ken Walker

    The spoiler section was a lot stronger than the actual review. Too often in the review you guys were pulling back in the review and you could tell you wanted so much to just go into spoilers. Maybe in the future separate the spoiler and reviews, that way each can be strong and focused.

    • This is a legitimate criticism of our review. Holding back is SUPER HARD for me (I would be the worst undercover cop ever). I appreciate the insight.

  • Beau

    Dear What I Pray is a Small Minority of our Listeners,

    Thanks for turning this gushing, praise laden review of my (thus far) favorite movie of the year into a referendum on completely missing the fucking point.

    Cheers!

  • NegPrimer

    I’ve been following OneOfUs since it started, as I was a fan of the LEOG years ago. But I’ve never subscribed. Every time I think about doing it, I see things like this thread, or hear a review that is just fanboy gushing without any critical analysis (not this review, but several in the past).

    Some of the people commenting might be assholes, or you might be misunderstanding them, or whatever the issue is, but that doesn’t excuse your behaviour. I look at the comments and the vast majority appear to be the people involved in the site getting into arguments. How can I justify giving money to a group whose only interaction with their fan base is to get into arguments with them in the comments?

    Mythic says something that, right or wrong, you construe as patronizing, and instead of saying “what do you mean?” or “hey that was patronizing, don’t be an asshole”, Chris delves into a wall of text insulting them, making comparisons to Rush Limbaugh. And that’s not even the end of it, other people from the site jump in, insulting, patronizing, even implying they don’t have the right to form their opinion because Mythic has a penis (which, incidentally, is never made apparent by Mythic, we’re all just making that assumption.)

    Whether Mythic & the other person (with deleted posts) was right or wrong or being an asshole doesn’t even matter at that point. All I see is people involved with the site arguing with their fans.

    • Chris Cox

      If you’re saying we’re just fanboy gushing, well, you certainly have a right to your opinion. We all honestly felt this was about as good as superhero films get and found little to criticize. If you disagree, that’s your prerogative, but it’s hardly fair to accuse us of doing nothing but ‘fanboy gushing’. We get the opposite accusations when we don’t like something enough for some fans. And so it goes.

      As to Mythic, he launched a tidal wave by throwing out the SJW comment which is about as politicized a commentary as you can make right now. To say anything different after the fact (which they did) is either a huge misunderstanding of what the term implies in the first place or is disingenuous at best. Repeated examples of myself and our reviewers being ‘your types’ only doubled down on the intent to insult nature of the remark. It wasn’t unclear at all what Mythic was saying and what he was saying was accusatory and specifically demeaning towards Sarah…on numerous responses afterwards as well.

      Look more carefully at how that conversation went in context of what I just said. And remember, we didn’t even get INTO any sort of gender discussion on this review. All that controversy was begun by Mythic and another commentator trying to find a reason to call us hypocrites. And to specifically mention that Sarah had nothing of value to add to the discussion, which is at the very least, rude, and from my point of view, very untrue.

      There’s quite obviously a lot of anger directed at us lately for even HAVING gender role discussions in film and tv. There’s a lot of gender role discussions about film and tv happening everywhere right now. Because, like it or not, agree with it or not, it is relevant and the fact that everyone is so riled up about it only puts a double underline on that. I’d also like to remind folks that we have repeatedly, on MULTIPLE reviews, DISAGREED on the relevance of the specific controversy over gender issues on things or even come out against some of those making claims of sexism where we didn’t think any existed.

      Honestly, more than anything, I’m just so tired of us having to defend the mere act of discussing them from time to time, which take up but a small part of any given review they appear on. I’m so taken aback by the pure vitriol that spills out and especially the short-sightedness…I can’t tell you how many things I’ve already read that ‘we do’ or ‘we don’t do’ on these reviews that is ridiculously and easily provably untrue so that someone can try to make us out to be hypocrites or one of ‘those types’ (I assume that means the angry interpretation of ‘feminist’).

      So what it comes down to, we can do what many…hell MOST review sites do, which is pointedly don’t engage at ALL with our comments or listeners…or we can try to respond to attacks, often rather personal, by trying to express our point of view as reasonably as we can muster. That often means explaining what is so distressing about the comment in the first place. If the comments from us get a bit of snark as the threads go along, well, you’d get tired too if you had to keep repeating the same thing over and over again.

      The last thing any of us want is to seek out to antagonize our fans. Why some fans go out of their way to try to do that to us, is an entirely other question. But this question has been pondered by critics and writers on the web since the first web page with a comment section appeared so I doubt I’m going to make any new headway on the philosophies involved. But to take this as an example as our standard interactions with our fans, well…maybe it’s because it’s probably more common for people to check out comments sections when they’ve turned into huge 40+ entry battles. I know I personally have a rich and warm relationship with A LOT of the fans of this site. Hell, half the people working for this site I met initially because they WERE fans and I hit it off with them.

      Anyway, I’m sorry this series of debates has given you the impression that this is standard fare. Only lately, and specifically with anger about gender discussions happening (at all and for any length of time whatsoever) has this become something that has sparked fuses. Maybe we could all learn to be a little more relaxed about it. No one is talking about banning anything and even if they did, about whatever the most atrocious example that made even me gag of frightening sexism in nerd media, I’d defend to the death their right to do it. Equally important is the right for people to discuss it and take umbrage with it. But it does nothing to further the discussion when we’re being told we’re horrible for having opinions about it.

      And, for the record, the deleted posts were deleted by the person who made the posts, not us.

      • Print and frame this, put it in a rocket ship, send it off to Mars, and hope our Martian Overlords read it and know we human beings are good.

      • mythic

        >>”Repeated examples of myself and our reviewers being ‘your types’ only doubled down on the intent to insult nature of the remark”<<
        I GENUINELY didn't mean it as a insult.
        I had to give at least a vague implication of the group of people I am referring too, I couldn't say liberals as that would instantly imply I am republican which I am not, I am centrist.
        I couldn't say feminist as I have no problem with real feminist out there saving sex slaves and making sure we have legal equality in this country.
        I am taking about the modern Internet brand of feminism and social movements which equates sex appeal for sex appeal sake instantly equalling objectification or police around the borders having Ar-15s to balance the scales with the cartel's Ak-47s as being facism.

    • Scott Johnson

      I would say Mythic being a dick does kind of play a role into it because he wasn’t even critiquing the review or making any commentary about the movie, he as just angry that gender issues were brought up AT ALL in this review. I don’t always agree with Sarah’s thoughts on gender but there’s a TACT
      to talking about or bringing up the critic’s opinions. (Plus she still
      absolutely loved the film too)

      Does that mean an asshole person should be allowed to go around unchallenged and spreading angry vitriol…NOT critique? Plus, I have no idea who Mythic is so saying he/she’s a “fan” is kind of hard to define since most of us have never seen him/her before. The OoU crew is rightfully upset because seeing unbridled hate is harmful towards any website and hurts the attendees. It was very much an angry, hateful rant and not an actual debate/well-constructed argument.

      And there is critique in this review towards the movie. Herman was unhappy it wasn’t a real Cpt. America movie and the jokes weren’t landing. Many people were complaining about wonky special effects. So I wouldn’t call it fanboy-ism, lots of websites are heaping praise on Civil War.

      I see your point in that the Internet is very defensive and it looks bad from a distance to fight with the audience. But I don’t think OneOfUs.net wants to be the website where we let trolls & hate-spewers sit around for entertainment or attention.

      • The great thing about OneofUs.net is that we don’t expect fans to agree with us all the time. We hardly ever agree with each other on most occasions. And that’s GREAT. It’s when things get personal that we come in, guns blazing to defend each other. (Hey, that’s what you get when you work with your friends.)

        • mythic

          I never made a personal attack against anyone.

          • “I have a problem with Cyrus being so afraid to offend you” – You
            “You loved Deadpool getting strap on fucked, but I guarantee had they had Morena Baccarin topless onscreen for more then half a minute you would have been violently pissed.” – You

            Making assumptions about rather personal reactions.

          • mythic

            You know what… the Deadpool comparison was too much.
            I apologize.

            I don’t have a problem with you or any woman on this site, I actually really liked somethings you had to say on the where to invade next review.

          • Apology accepted.

    • mythic

      Neg, I have also been following this site from the beginning.
      I didn’t mean to do so, but it’s clear I hit a nerve. Please don’t allow the sites disagreement with my comments cause a problem with your enjoyment of the podcast, I never intended for such to happen.
      Sorry.